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Viper
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| Posted: October 15 2008 at 10:46 | IP Logged
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Last week I got an upgrade offer for HouseLinc 2 with a PLM. I'm no longer interested in HouseLinc, but I am interested in the PLM. However, it appears I have two options: Serial or USB. I'm pretty sure PH2 supports the Serial PLM, but given that I'm running my house on with a laptop with no Serial, the USB PLM is more interesting.
So, does PH2 support a USB PLM?
Thanks! Tom
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nadler
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| Posted: October 15 2008 at 10:53 | IP Logged
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PH2 does support the USB PLM. If you look at the new
wizard (the yellow star on the toolbar) and click on the
Controller button and then Insteon, the USB PLM is
listed.
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grif091
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| Posted: October 15 2008 at 10:57 | IP Logged
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Your question notwithstanding, those are HL2 enabled PLMs. There are a series of questions on the Smarthome forum regarding function/compatibility of those "HL2 enabled" devices that have not been answered.
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Lee G
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Viper
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| Posted: October 15 2008 at 11:20 | IP Logged
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Nadler, Thanks for the info. I've been slow to go to PH2 as I keep this system in a hole and it runs not only my house but the family mail server and web server.
Lee, Thanks for the point on lack of information from Smarthome. Too bad for them as I had the upgrade in the cart as well as a bunch of other stuff. I can wait....
Tom
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grif091
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| Posted: October 15 2008 at 17:55 | IP Logged
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See last post in this topic. I take this to mean SH is not going to formally respond to the HL2 PLM questions.
http://www.techmall.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=4246
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Lee G
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BeachBum
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| Posted: October 15 2008 at 18:01 | IP Logged
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I too have been following this. Sure is an interesting business decision.
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Pete - X10 Oldie
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pwmcmaho
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| Posted: November 02 2008 at 22:44 | IP Logged
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anybody have any new news to report here? Was looking to pull the trigger to swap my PLC for the PLM, but not if Powerhome breaks...
Thanks!
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grif091
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| Posted: November 03 2008 at 04:24 | IP Logged
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Smarthome has shown no willingness to publish the differences in a HL2 enabled PLM. Answer may be in the Developer SDK but anyone with access to that information has signed a NDA so that path is blocked. Solution is for someone who has not signed the NDA to try it and post the results. Want to be the first?
EDIT: there is the same question on the Smarthome forum with the same motivation. Folks want to trade their old PLC for a new PLM to use with other products like PowerHome or ISY, for free. No intention of using HL2. The only way SH can prevent the flood of that kind of order is to stand mute on the compatibility question. If my hunch is correct, once the 12/31/2008 date passes for the free upgrade to HL2, the compatibility answer will leak out.
Edited by grif091 - November 03 2008 at 11:12
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Lee G
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grif091
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| Posted: November 04 2008 at 18:51 | IP Logged
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I have defined my HL2 enabled Serial PLM as the PowerHome Controller. PowerHome had no problem connecting to it. Seems to be working fine but I'm letting PH do a full Status Scan of all my devices. I'll post back results after more extensive testing. Probably be tomorrow before all my devices have been scanned.
Anyone thinking about ordering the HL2 Upgrade be sure to order the correct item number. HL2 with PLM can be ordered that is NOT the upgrade option. Make sure the item number ends with an R. I made the mistake when ordering and Smarthome will not honor the Rebate (actually no rebate form included and they refuse to mail me a rebate form) based on what I ordered. I have to return the non Rebate order and reorder the Rebate version, even though the only difference is the Rebate form in the package.
EDIT: Device Status does not work using the HL2 enabled PLM. Insteon command not issued and the yellow on/off status does not change. Went back to PLC and Device Status works as usual.
EDIT2: Thanks to Dave's query I had not changed the device definitions to use the PLM. When I changed the X10 and Insteon device definitions to use the PLM the Device Status works fine.
Edited by grif091 - November 06 2008 at 22:46
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Lee G
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ficklma1
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| Posted: November 06 2008 at 19:30 | IP Logged
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Dave, Any chance having this USB PLM supported in the future?
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bmwragtop
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| Posted: November 06 2008 at 20:35 | IP Logged
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Note that the new version of PLM is being shipped for serial and USB interfaces. Hopefully Dave will be able to get his hands on one to figure out the updated interface.
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dhoward
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| Posted: November 06 2008 at 22:18 | IP Logged
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Actually, PowerHome already supports the USB version of the PLM. The USB version comes with drivers that emulate a serial port so just select the standard "Insteon PLM" controller in the Setup section and give it the COM number that was setup by the driver.
I have been running my house on a USB PLM for several months now.
HTH,
Dave.
Lee, just caught the edit to your post. Did the device scan work? Is it just the Device Status that doesn't work? If so, did you change the controller associated with each Insteon device to match the new PLM?
Thanks,
Dave.
Edited by dhoward - November 06 2008 at 22:21
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grif091
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| Posted: November 06 2008 at 22:43 | IP Logged
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This is embarrassing. The Status Scan ran fine. Took it a bit to pick up some link changes I had made outside of PowerHome but it eventually started cycling through the device list cleanly.
I had "assumed" that if the Status Scan was running it must have switched the Controller to the only one active, the PLM. Thanks to your query I just switched back to the PLM definition, scrolled right and found the device entries were still pointing to the PLC. Switched the X10 and Insteon device definitions to the PLM and Device Status is working just fine.
Thanks Dave. I will leave PH running on the HL2 enabled PLM. This is really a great result. We still do not know what SH added/changed to make it HL2 enabled but I really don't care.
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Lee G
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Viper
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| Posted: November 08 2008 at 18:44 | IP Logged
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Dave,
I went and did it. I loaded PH2 on a new machine, copied my pwrhome.db and pwrhome.ini over to the new machine. Ran PHUPG.EXE. Connected the PLC. Attached the PLM and loaded the two drivers from HL2. Created a new device in PH2 for the PLM. Configured a Controller, for the PLM. Enabled the PLM and disabled the PLC as controllers. Copied all the Controller and Response links from the PLC to the PLM. Changed all the Insteon and X10 devices to use the PLM as the controller. Disconnected the PLC. Removed all the links to the PLC from all the devices. Deleted the PLC from PH2. Rebuilt every device and the PLM.
PH2 seems to control and see all the events going on in the house just fine and triggers the macros when a device is turned on or off.
Now for the bad news. PH2 is not updating the status of the devices in the data base when the change is made at a device.
If a change is made from PH2, the data base is updated. If I do a ph_getinsteonlevelrt() to a device, the status is updated in the data base.
I have a multitude of macros that are dependent on the state of other devices. (Turn the lights on if they are off and the basement lights are on and motion is detected at the door - Turn the lights on for me, not the cats...) (Turn the warning light on in the shop if the dust collector is running and the shop lights are on and motion is detected at the door - Turn the warning lght on because I'm using a power tool and someone has entered the room behind me)
Right now I'm adding a trigger to do the ph_getinsteonlevelrt to each device that is important I know the level of.
Tom
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dhoward
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| Posted: November 09 2008 at 14:45 | IP Logged
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Tom
It sounds as if you've done most everything but I didnt see mention of "Add Min" or "Add Full". If you havent already done it, open the Insteon Explorer and on the "Setup" tab, do the "Clear" followed by the "Add Full" (I believe the newer PLM's require Add Full rather than Add Min).
After you do this, there should be no reason why the PLM should not track changes at the device.
Dave.
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bmwragtop
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| Posted: November 09 2008 at 15:07 | IP Logged
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Do you think the 2 drivers from HL2 are necessary?
I'm getting ready to install my "HL2 Enabled PLM", and I don't see why HL2 device drivers would necessarily be needed for PH2.
Thanks,
Tom G.
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grif091
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| Posted: November 09 2008 at 16:16 | IP Logged
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Don't think the Serial PLM requires anything special. See Dave's post earlier in this topic about a USB PLM. The Smarthome driver is required as it emulates a Comm port for a USB PLM.
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Lee G
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bmwragtop
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| Posted: November 09 2008 at 16:34 | IP Logged
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Thanks Lee. I will be using the serial version, so that is where my brain slipped a cog.  I prefer to minimize the amount of SmartHome software running on my system.
Edited by bmwragtop - November 09 2008 at 16:40
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Viper
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| Posted: November 10 2008 at 13:09 | IP Logged
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Dave,
Thanks for the guidance. That helped immensely. Perhaps an update to the Wiki or FAQ would be in order for PLC to PLM upgrades.
Another question: I have a switch (SHOP LIGHTS), that I turn on with a macro when a particular X10 event occurs (MOTION AT SHOP DOOR). With the PLC, this was practically flawless. With the PLM, the SHOP LIGHTS ON is sent out, but 9 times out of 10, the SHOP LIGHTS doesn't see the direct command. But if after telling the SHOP LIGHTS to go ON, I get the level and try again if the SHOP LIGHTS aren't yet on, nearly 100% of the time, the SHOP LIGHTS go ON and an ACK comes back. I suspect that the X10 is doing something to clobber the Insteon command to the SHOP LIGHTS.
So the question is, with the PLM, who is responsible for retries? I seem to remember (maybe incorrectly) that the PLC used to do the retries, but is that the case with the PLM?
Thanks!
Tom
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grif091
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| Posted: November 10 2008 at 16:15 | IP Logged
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As a diagnostic technique, add a Wait (2 or 3 seconds) in the macro before sending the SHOP LIGHTS ON to give some separation between inbound X10 and the outbound Insteon. Also in another thread Dave has found a problem where a foreground Insteon command can be lost when issued while the background Status Scan activity is going on. Could try stopping the Status Scan, if you run with it on, and see if that improves the SHOP LIGHT reliability. In this failure the Insteon command was not sent on the powerline. Easy to see from the trace once it was captured. The failure in the other thread was very infrequent so it probably does not apply here. The Insteon retry mechanism is built into each hardware device. Have not seen anything to suggest the PLM does not have that facility. When the SHOP LIGHT does not turn On do you see the Insteon ON command in the Insteon Raw Log?
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Lee G
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Topic: PLC to USB PLM Upgrade Offer
