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jpcurcio
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| Posted: November 13 2008 at 00:12 | IP Logged
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Finally got back to the Insteon Motion Sensor testing, and I've found an issue.
I can link it to a device without a problem (for example, a LampLinc) and it works. However, when I create a link to the PLC, and create a trigger for the device, it doesn't seem to trigger.
Any suggestions?
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grif091
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| Posted: November 13 2008 at 04:36 | IP Logged
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Do you see the Group messages from the motion sensor to the PLC in the Insteon Raw Log and/or Event Log when motion is detected. Are the links between the motion sensor and the PLC showing verified and what type of trigger did you define?
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jeffw_00
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| Posted: November 13 2008 at 21:13 | IP Logged
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I'm triggering on "Insteon Group In" ID 1 on/off (motion) ID 2 on/off (dusk/dawn). ID3 on (low batt)
works for me 8-}
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jpcurcio
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| Posted: November 13 2008 at 22:42 | IP Logged
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I'm noting some really strange behavior...
Yesterday, I was actually able to get the sensors to link. Since it seemed to have stopped working, I removed the links and can't, for some reason, get them to re-link. I am setting up the motion sensor as the controller, and the PLC as the responder. The responder link is created, but it won't create the controller. Yes, I am putting the sensor into "link" mode in order to create the link. I even tried the "factory reset" on the sensor, but it seems to make no difference.
I tried re-linking the access points, and they are definitely working. My RemoteLinc still works, but for some reason, I can't get either of the motion sensors to link.
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grif091
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 00:43 | IP Logged
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What does the link entry say for the status of the link? I presume not verified. Check motion sensor device entry, Clear Failed column, for red shading. If red shaded, check column so PH will start communicating with device again. If PH tried to communicate with the motion sensor during a status scan, or before you put the motion sensor into linking mode, the communication would fail and PH will mark the device Clear Failed column with red shading and stop communication with the device.
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jpcurcio
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 01:20 | IP Logged
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grif091 wrote:
| What does the link entry say for the status of the link? I presume not verified. Check motion sensor device entry, Clear Failed column, for red shading. If red shaded, check column so PH will start communicating with device again. If PH tried to communicate with the motion sensor during a status scan, or before you put the motion sensor into linking mode, the communication would fail and PH will mark the device Clear Failed column with red shading and stop communication with the device. |
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When I first created the link (or, re-created after deleting all links, the device, and doing a factory reset on the motion sensor), both the controller and responder links were verified. Immediately after linking, I was able to get the motion sensor to trigger the macro exactly once. After that, it didn't respond at all.
The "Clear Failed" column is not red; I have it set to 100 Max Failures. Even if I try to re-verify by putting the sensor into the "program" mode, the communication succeeds (as evidenced by the reports screen, with lots of blue bars), but it won't verify the link.
BTW, I am using PowerHome2, if it matters...
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grif091
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 02:14 | IP Logged
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The link must be in place for the motion sensor to send a group command and PH detect it causing the trigger to fire. At that point I would stop looking at links and at start looking at motion sensor options and the motion sensor to AP communication.
I don't have a motion sensor because of the delays in shipment but from the Smarthome forum it seems the motion sensor will trigger only after an internal timer runs down. You don't get a motion message every time is senses motion. Once it sends an ON, the internal timer has to run down before it will send another. It started out at 7 minutes but was later reduced to 1 minute based on user feedback. There is also a night only mode where it does not send motion messages unless it is dark. This is all from forum discussion only. Then there is the question of the motion sensor communicating with the AP. There was a case recently where the AP was plugged into a PLM to resolve a general comm problem. Not suggesting you have a comm problem but putting an AP at the PLC/PLM connection and moving the motion sensor close to the AP should remove any question of the RF communication side.
I would get it back to the point where the link says verified and then look at the sensor options and AP communication. Even a Pending on a link query would not remove the old link.
I would put the max error count back to the normal value. The red shading was always a positive indicator that there was a communication problem. That is even more important for an RF based device. Setting the max errors so high you take away that indicator. It would mean checking the device entry but if there is no communication you would know about it. Don’t know how many errors it takes to affect the Reports information.
EDIT: Did some more research on the Smarthome forum. The motion sensor OFF timeout is now 1 minute. However, each motion the sensor detects resets the timer to a fresh 1 minute interval even though a new ON is not sent. So if you are triggering motion every 30 seconds you will not see a new ON nor will you see an OFF until a full 1 minute interval has elapsed with no motion detected. Also some of the latest posts indicate that HL2 can set that 1 minute interval from 30 seconds to 2 hours in 30 second increments.
Edited by grif091 - November 14 2008 at 10:41
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jpcurcio
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 17:51 | IP Logged
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I understand the 1-minute time-out; it isn't the issue. I can wait for hours between triggering it and there are no communications sent. It's like the link disappears.
The motion sensor (MS) is in the same room as the access point (AP); about 10 feet away. The RemoteLinc works well, so I doubt it's the AP.
It seemed to work when I had the MS linked directly to a LampLinc unit, but for some reason it doesn't like the PLC. Can I manually link the MS to the PLC by pressing the button on the side? Does it even have a link button on the PLC (been a while since I've looked)?
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BeachBum
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 18:22 | IP Logged
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Yes there is a button on the PLC. It would be nice if we could see some Raw Log data of the failure.
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jpcurcio
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 18:29 | IP Logged
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BeachBum wrote:
| Yes there is a button on the PLC. It would be nice if we could see some Raw Log data of the failure. |
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Actually, I tried to log raw data to a file, but PH2 crapped the bed on me when I tried. Had to reload the DB from a back-up copy at that point.
Edited by jpcurcio - November 14 2008 at 18:30
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grif091
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 20:57 | IP Logged
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Jeffw_00, did you establish your motion sensor links using PH or the Set button. I noticed the specs for the motion sensor indicates support for only 30 links. Could be the normal FF8 starting location for the link database that PH assumes (unless working with new PLM) might not be the correct location for a device that supports only 30 links.
jpcurcio, did you use setup to define the path to the log file before checking the Echo Raw Log box. I think the idea you have about establishing a link from the motion sensor to the PLC with the Set button is a good one. It would answer the question about the link database location.
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jeffw_00
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 20:59 | IP Logged
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I never touch a set button - everything's linked back to the PLC via PH.
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nadler
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 21:39 | IP Logged
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This might be the answer to your issue. It's from Dave.
PowerHome will NOT be able to program (create links,
etc.) to the motion sensor since SmartHome did not
include support for the standard peek and poke commands.
They ONLY support the newer extended commands for
working with links. This means that currently PH cannot
program them (nor can any other software).
Once the links are created however, PH can operate with
the Motion sensor no problem. The best way to handle
the motion sensor is to manually create the link between
the MS and the PLM/PLC with the MS as a controller and
the PLC/PLM as the responder. Once this is done, PH
will then be able to sense the incoming group commands
from the MS and fire triggers appropriately.
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jeffw_00
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| Posted: November 14 2008 at 21:44 | IP Logged
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nadler wrote:
The best way to handle
the motion sensor is to manually create the link between
the MS and the PLM/PLC with the MS as a controller and
the PLC/PLM as the responder. Once this is done, PH
will then be able to sense the incoming group commands
from the MS and fire triggers appropriately.
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Yup - that's what i did
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jpcurcio
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| Posted: November 15 2008 at 01:23 | IP Logged
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nadler wrote:
This might be the answer to your issue. It's from Dave.
PowerHome will NOT be able to program (create links,
etc.) to the motion sensor since SmartHome did not
include support for the standard peek and poke commands.
They ONLY support the newer extended commands for
working with links. This means that currently PH cannot
program them (nor can any other software).
Once the links are created however, PH can operate with
the Motion sensor no problem. The best way to handle
the motion sensor is to manually create the link between
the MS and the PLM/PLC with the MS as a controller and
the PLC/PLM as the responder. Once this is done, PH
will then be able to sense the incoming group commands
from the MS and fire triggers appropriately.
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Nadler:
Thanks! That explains the situation to me a little better. I did the olde-fashioned linking by pressing the buttons, and it seems to work (still holding my breath, though).
However, this leads to another question. When I pull up the "Links" tab, I see the manually created links, but the "Ctlr Link Status" is "LINK NOT FOUND" in one case, and "CHECKING" in the other case. Is there any way to "clear" these, since with the manual creation of the links, there is no way for PH2 to verify them.
-John
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jpcurcio
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| Posted: November 15 2008 at 12:33 | IP Logged
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Well, the two MSs still seem to be working. Thanks to all for the help.
Now on to bigger and better things... like setting up macros/timed events/etc with them.
-John
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Lazyman
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| Posted: December 03 2008 at 12:00 | IP Logged
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I just got an Insteon Motion Sensor and I am havng a hard time using it with PowerHome. Sorry to ask a basic question, but even with reading the forum, I am not figuring out.
I would like the motion sensor to trigger a group on (if certain devices are at zero), and then turn the group off after 5 minutes.
It seems to me, I only need to set it as a trigger, but it is not working. I suspect I do no understand each entry in the trigger page row.
Any suggestions or help please.
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BeachBum
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| Posted: December 03 2008 at 12:14 | IP Logged
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Make sure you manually link the Motion Sensor to the PLC/PLM using the set button. In PH make sure you have the PLC/PLM as a responder to the Motion Sensor. When you do this you have to manually put the Motion Sensor in link mode (set button) for this to take. After all that you should be able to trigger on Group In On group #1.
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Lazyman
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| Posted: December 03 2008 at 13:34 | IP Logged
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I think that is where I left off in trouble shooting. How do you manually link the motino sensor to the PLC.
I can put the motion sensor into linking mode, but then how do I link to the PLC. I tried pushing the set button which does not seem to do it.
(I manually linked the motion sensor to a switchlinc to make sure the signal was being received and that worked fine. I then manually removed that link).
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jeffw_00
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| Posted: December 03 2008 at 13:45 | IP Logged
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you don't need to push or tap any buttons to link Motion Sensor to PLC. Just go into power home and link it as if it was a KPL or remotelinc. you want to link groups 1-2 on/off and group3 on.
see my posts higher up
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Topic: Insteon Motion Sensor Issue
